Buying my first chisels

[Leadbelly]

Looking for advice,

I have a lathe and a couple second hand chisels that were given to me. I am looking to buy some chisels for turning pens, the good news is the kids will buy me them for me for Christmas.

Am I better off getting the carbide insert radius cutters and handle sets for turning the pens as i have seen on Youtube. I like the idea of just turning the insert around and not having to buy a good sharpening wheel, I will be able to use the wheel money towards the chisels, not sure if this is the right thought process please advise.

I am long enough in the tooth to understand 'walk before you run' but it has always paid me in the long run to purchase quality tools and equipment within reason of course.

What would you purchase and where from, based on there might not be the availability of choice here in Ireland.

Russ.

 

[Penpal]

There is a learning curve for both types of chisel,you need to start somewhere and carbide is the newer and I would think the favourite way to go now.

Peter.

 

[Dalboy]

Personally I would go for some HSS tools and a grinder. I am not a lover of the carbide tools as they are more like scrapers.

 

[Lons]

Same opinion a Derek, my preference would be to get your sharpening system sorted, you're going to need it, you still have to sharpen your parting tools etc.
If you want carbide tools they are easy enough to make yourself in any case. I have several though I far prefer the usual HSS roughing gouge and skew.

 

[Terry Q]

I won some carbide tools in my clubs monthly raffle a couple years ago and they are still unused. My two pen turning tools are a 1/2 roughing gouge and a 3/4 spindle gouge with swept back wings. Mostly I use the spindle gouge.

 

[Penpal]

A must have chisel is the one thats fit for purpose when you really need it. Write down your intentions and purchase accordingly. Club crawling also opens up the experience quickly.,the most helpful of tips came to me early when I began to sharpen on the grinder chisels held horizontally so I could read the angles more accurately. An elderly guy (to me 35 yrs ago only turned bridge timber large table lamps using a scraper only and making his own woven raffia shades he won the annual prize for years with his immaculate finished lamps. He used to visit a mutual friend of ours with three scrapers for him to sharpen for him. I could only just carry the blanks let alone turn them. Another Dutch guy created huge platters using only a 1/4 inch bowl gouge ever so slowly and carefully. Both self taught and masterful results that commanded huge to me prices in the Art World.The latter guy spent a day and a half ended up with a 1000 dollar platter from that 1/4 inch chisel. Design and shape perfection comes with practice and mastery.Turning items such as the rocklike Wooly Mammoth Tooth from the Tundra in Russia only the carbide to me was a practical chisel for the task

There is a need for discipline when turning for two reasons,one for other people to purchase and your own safe practices on the lathe.

Peter.

Peter.

 

[21William]

Carbide insert tools are great for newcomers - no grinder required and no sharpening technique to master either. They are also in my experience much quicker to learn to use and less chance of dig-ins and catches etc. They are also good for use on hard materials that quickly wear out HSS.
Many experienced turners hate them for all the reasons above!

Carbide wasn’t around when I learnt to turn so I have lots of HSS tools that I use on a regular basis. You can’t beat the finish you can get on some materials with HSS spindle gouges and skew chisels etc. I really like my HSS spindle roughing gouge that I used just yesterday.

The sensible approach in my opinion is not to ignore any tooling that’s available out there just because some other turners have a bias.

There is absolutely nothing stopping you from using both types. I personally find the round (rather than square) carbide insert tools of more use and particularly like the 9mm flat inserts. I’ve made all my own tooling for carbide inserts but you can of course buy them complete from places like:

Replacement Carbide Cutters

I get most of my inserts from Glen.

If I had to start over, for Pen turning I’d get a small spindle roughing gouge, a 5/16” spindle gouge with a long grind, a 1/2” or maybe 3/4” skew chisel and a 9mm round carbide. Others will of course have their own preferences ... good luck and good turning!

Edit: I forgot that I’ve already got a grinder so you will need one at some point for HSS.

 

[Phil Dart]

Carbide cutters are increasingly popular amongst pen turners, but their popularity is because many people turn pens as their first experience of woodturning, so they don't know how to use traditional gouges. You can (and people do) get good results from carbide cutters, and they have a place even if you are a gouge user (certain materials respond well if the final cut is with a scraper, and certain materials - ebonite for instance - are just better cut with a carbide from start to finish). However, the most vocal arguments in favour of carbides are from carbide users who have never tried gouges. I have never seen an argument favouring them over gouges from someone who knows how to use both (myself included).

In my opinion, if you can stand the expense of a sharpening system, then gouges will provide infinitely more versatility than carbides, and in addition will give better results on tricky materials such as friable or splintery or sinewy woods, but only if you find out how to use them properly. A carbide is useful on materials that have a high blunting effect of cutting edges, and in general will give you a good result in a range of materials in an afternoon, but will limit you to "good" results for the rest of time.

(Edit - sorry William. You posted while I was typing. We've said more or less the same thing I see)

 

[AllenN]

I second what Phil said. If you do decide to make your own carbide holders just make sure you get carbide inserts for wood turning and not those for metal turning lathes.

 

[21William]

Engineering insert manufacturers make polished inserts for cutting Aluminium Alloys, plastics and other soft materials. These inserts whilst designed for engineering lathes work very well cutting wood. Basically if it’s sharp it will cut fine whatever it’s original intended use.

This tool uses the polished round inserts.

10mm Shear Cut / Hollower

Unlike the flat inserts though you can’t resharpen them on a diamond hone.

 

[Pierre]

As you can see many opinions...In my experience and I have tried both, the carbide ones don't allow you to slide the bevel or get the correct slicing angle that you get from a gouge or a skew so the wood gets ripped rather than sliced. This is all well and good for a hard wood but when you get to soft wood or even Oak then you get chipping or minute holes which are more difficult to remove or hide. I tend to use carbide as a hollowing tool and gouges or skews as an exterior cutting and finishing tool. If you learn both then you will get a much wider repertoire of turning and use less sandpaper :wink: personally I use an Ashley Iles Martin Pigeon allrounder with long sides as a shaping and tool and skew at the same time then you dont get the catches of a skew.

PG

 

[Leadbelly]

Thanks one and all for you time and trouble really helpful and has put me on the right track.

I intend to learn both practices... hence running out today and picked up some second hand Record Power chisels in mint condition I might add for €60.
2/8 - 3/8 - 1/2 " and a 1" gouges 1" skew 3/8 parting tool and a 3/32 parting tool I don't think they are HSS though?.

My kids keep asking me what I want for Christmas and as I had to pay for my own teeth last Christmas I am taking nothing but cash I intend to purchase some good quality chisels with the funds 300 to 400 euros, if you only had the chisels I have just purchased what would you buy.

Russ.

 

[Leadbelly]

Just put my glasses on and in quite big letters on the shafts it reads HSS

 

[Pierre]

Personally I would buy a roughing gouge Axminster HSS Spindle Roughing Gouge - Woodturning Gouges - Woodturning Tools - Lathe Accessories - Machinery Accessories - Accessories | Axminster Tools & Machinery

A parting tool, this can be used as a beading tool as well Henry Taylor Parting Tools - Woodturning Beading & Parting Tools - Woodturning Tools - Lathe Accessories - Machinery Accessories - Accessories | Axminster Tools & Machinery

if you want a sturdy bowl gouge and with long sides ground to an elsworth shape then this is great 12mm 1/2 Martin Pidgen All Rounder (Multi-purpose Gouge) [H68] : Ashley Iles Tool Store

and maybe a half round scraper, with all of those you can do virtually everything on top of the tools you have already. The specialist tools come later as you develop your skills and the bug for turning and everyone buys a new one for each event in your life.

Spend the rest of your money on a decent sharpening system with the appropriate grinding attachments, speak to Glen Lucas in Ireland Glenn Lucas Master Woodturner | Woodturning classes, videos & tools based in Ireland he is an excellent turner and teacher (and drinker tell him I said so!!). I personally like Tormek, others will say Sorby, whatever if your tools aren't sharp they will not work and you will give up out of frustration.

Have fun

PG

 

[21William]

I’ve bought several parting tools before and hardly ever use them since I bought a Firmager:

Crown Hand Tools Firmager Thin Parting Tool 1.5mm/1/16in. | The Toolpost

I was using my spindle roughing gouge on a handle the other day and it was cutting so well I wished it was smaller so I could do even more of the turning with it. I’m now thinking of adding a 3/4” one to my tool collection.

 

[Penpal]

I rarely if ever use some of the chisels listed,after a while we all favour but a few of the long list. most excitement over the so called NEW chisels wanes.

Peter.

 

[Leadbelly]

Honestly deep appreciation of all advice given and the more I follow up on the said advice the more i'm hooked. Great and very useful links and now I have had 5 posts and been able to look at your work it confirms to me I will always be a jack of all trade and not a master. This truly is not meant to be patronising or with a ( Z ) I am like a kid at Christmas.

Russ.

 

[Phil Dart]

... hence running out today and picked up some second hand Record Power chisels in mint condition I might add for €60.
2/8 - 3/8 - 1/2 " and a 1" gouges 1" skew 3/8 parting tool and a 3/32 parting tool

I intend to purchase some good quality chisels with the funds 300 to 400 euros, if you only had the chisels I have just purchased what would you buy.

Russ.

I wouldn't use the money to buy any more chisels at all to be frank. The ones you have are descent enough quality to get you started, and you have a wide enough selection to begin with too. As you gain experience, you will be able to establish for yourself where the gaps are in your tool collection and which ones you may wish to upgrade, rather than rushing out now and spending on tools you may never use.

Personally, I would spend the money on a good sharpening system,, like the Sorby ProEdge.

 

[wm460]

My favourite chisel for turning pens is a 1/2" skew.