Barry
Graduate Member
I have just got a length of 1/4 silver steel to make a spare mandrel And to harden it hope it will stop any flexing Do you heat it to were it starts to turn straw colour then quench in water
-
Thanks for visiting The Penturners Forum today.
There are many features and resources that currently you are unable to see or access, either because you're not yet registered, or if you're already registered, because you're not logged in.
To gain full access to the forum, please log in or register now. Registration is completely free, it only takes a few seconds, and you can join our well established community of like-minded pen makers.
How do you temper silver steel
- Thread starter Barry
- Start date
Barry
Graduate Member
I always thought the bushings were 6 mm but no its 1/4
Attachments
I have tried this but I can't claim success. I understand it to be a two-stage process, the first stage involving heating the metal to a cherry-red colour (about as hot as you can get it). subtlety doesn't seem to be needed for this one. The steel will either be oil-quenching or water-quenching, whichever you need have a bowl of it handy and thrust the metal into it as quickly and smoothly as possible. The metal is now 'dead hard', which is very brittle. So stage two is removing some of the hardness. First clean up the metal so that you can see it'c colours as it heats. Then heat it carefully until it just turns a straw colour (it will quickly progress to another hue so now you need to be quick) and then quench it again. this should leave the metal 'work hard' but not so hard it's brittle.
I'm not sure why you would need to do this twice (and not just do the second process on it's own) but everything i've read has pointed me to this method.
I'm not sure why you would need to do this twice (and not just do the second process on it's own) but everything i've read has pointed me to this method.
Bigblackdog
Registered
In simple terms, heating the metal and sudden plunging into water or oil traps the steel particles in a position that it wouldn't normally be in. Heating again relaxes it slightly so the particles can move a little. If you did it in a single cycle they would either not get hot enough to move properly (so steel isn't hard) or would not get the chance to relax (so remains brittle).
I have 3 lengths of stainless 1\4 and are too big ..just thought i would mention before u go down that route
Steve
ZuluTiming
Full Member
As has been said it is a twin stage process but the exact science of it is nebulous, there are different schools of thought on how it should be done.
Silver steel by nature is hard enuf not to need tempering for you needs, and the cost in time and energy could outway the cost of buying a mandrel.
Te steel foundry next to my old unit would heat to red hot and quench then heat to red hot and allow to cool naturally, I have always done same and never had any issue with any steel hey are structural steelworks so should know what they are doing.
Silver steel by nature is hard enuf not to need tempering for you needs, and the cost in time and energy could outway the cost of buying a mandrel.
Te steel foundry next to my old unit would heat to red hot and quench then heat to red hot and allow to cool naturally, I have always done same and never had any issue with any steel hey are structural steelworks so should know what they are doing.
As others have said Barry its probably less hassle to buy a mandrel or use the steel as is heating and cooling can also alter the size of the steel even a small amount of movement
could cause problems with bushes
could cause problems with bushes
No need with silver steel most mandrel measure 6.24 mm
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
- Joined
- Jan 31, 2013
- Posts
- 9,504
- First Name
- Terry
Barry I don't think you will achieve anything by trying to harden and temper your steel. I was taught how to do it years ago and I'll tell you what to do if you want to have a go.
Hardening is self explanatory while tempering is taking the brittleness out of the hardening. To harden a tool steel heat it till it is cherry red and you can use oxy acetylene to do it. You can quench it in either water or oil but I would recommend for a novice to use oil. The reason I say this is because water can "shock" steel when quenching causing internal stresses which will show up as internal cracks whereas oil doesn't shock the steel. To temper a length of hardened steel rod would mean tempering the ends only. To temper would mean firstly cleaning the steel and then warming the steel up again. You will see colours showing in the steel which will move to the end of the steel rod. The colours are light straw/ dark straw/ purple and then blue. When the required colour reaches the end of the steel then quench again in oil.
If you are doing wood chisels for example then the colour would be light straw. Screwdrivers are dark straw. Cold chisels are purple and springs are blue. Obviously there are many other items that hardened and tempered and these are just examples.
Remember the ends of the steel will be tempered but the middle of the rod will still have its original hardness.
Hope this helps !!!!
Hardening is self explanatory while tempering is taking the brittleness out of the hardening. To harden a tool steel heat it till it is cherry red and you can use oxy acetylene to do it. You can quench it in either water or oil but I would recommend for a novice to use oil. The reason I say this is because water can "shock" steel when quenching causing internal stresses which will show up as internal cracks whereas oil doesn't shock the steel. To temper a length of hardened steel rod would mean tempering the ends only. To temper would mean firstly cleaning the steel and then warming the steel up again. You will see colours showing in the steel which will move to the end of the steel rod. The colours are light straw/ dark straw/ purple and then blue. When the required colour reaches the end of the steel then quench again in oil.
If you are doing wood chisels for example then the colour would be light straw. Screwdrivers are dark straw. Cold chisels are purple and springs are blue. Obviously there are many other items that hardened and tempered and these are just examples.
Remember the ends of the steel will be tempered but the middle of the rod will still have its original hardness.
Hope this helps !!!!
Cherry red and dark straw were shown to me by a wise old man. No not Terry!
We used to make a screwdriver project at the school that used 1/8" silver steel for the blade.
The teacher used to show hardening by quenching a piece of cherry red steel, putting it in a vice, and hitting it with a hammer!
Bl##dy thing would shear straight off, and go flying across the room!
He would then harden and temper a piece to straw, and repeat.
Once the kids had recovered from their rapid ducking movements, they were awestruck that it had only bent!
If we did it now the kids would want to know why the material was not provided fit for purpose in the first place!
OFSTED would ask what the children could possibly have learned from this lesson, and can the lesson show progression to meet the current government targets, and why did we talk about Ferrous metals and Carbon, when the obvious answer to the origin of steel is China!
Penpal
Grand Master
For umpteen years my mandrels were long machined bolts I used to go through the pile and use a brass sleeve as a go no go guage after all if it fits its cheap and available, hardening mandrels better to go mandrelless mate make your own bushes.
Peter.
Peter.
wm460
Grand Master
- Joined
- Mar 16, 2013
- Posts
- 23,133
- First Name
- Mark
