CA Finish

[Walter]

And to put an end to uninformed debate as to whether or not there are possible harmful long term effects from inhalation of the vapour here is a Concise International Chemical Assessment Document published by the World health Organisation.

http://www.who.int/ipcs/publications/cicad/cicad36_rev_1.pdf

The findings are hardly conclusive one way or the other.

 

[Walter]

BLO

Going back to your comment that you find using BLO reduces the fumes, I find the opposite. When I use BLO the pong is even stringer.

 

[Woody]

I think it all boils down to good ol common sense in the end Walter personally working with the stuff can effect my emphysema for at least a week after use even with a carbon face mask so I only ever use it outside and for as short a period possible and avoid using it were there is an alternative

 

[Walter]

I think it all boils down to good ol common sense in the end Walter personally working with the stuff can effect my emphysema for at least a week after use even with a carbon face mask so I only ever use it outside and for as short a period possible and avoid using it were there is an alternative

I agree Woody. But there is so much bollocks talked about CA not just on here but on every woodworking forum you can name I just wanted to make sure that there were some indisputable facts from reliable sources on the table.

 

[Grump]

And I just wanted to disperse some of the scaremongery away from a subject that people fear so much init?
Now the subject of casting acrylics is so much more dangerous init, the chemicals involved in that are much more unhealthy than a bit of glue.

 

[Walter]

And I just wanted to disperse some of the scaremongery away from a subject that people fear so much init?
Now the subject of casting acrylics is so much more dangerous init, the chemicals involved in that are much more unhealthy than a bit of glue.

I would certainly agree, on the basis of the factual evidence, that some of the aforementioned bollocks considerably overstates the risks involved and that the precautions required are no more than those set out in the Safety Data Sheet you provided a link to earlier.

As to whether the chemicals involved in casting acrylics are more dangerous I have no reason to doubt that you are correct and claim no expertise in that area. Your personal experience of the effects should be a warning to anyone about the dangers of over exposure.

 

[Woody]

And I just wanted to disperse some of the scaremongery away from a subject that people fear so much init?
Now the subject of casting acrylics is so much more dangerous init, the chemicals involved in that are much more unhealthy than a bit of glue.

That may be so Brian but it don't change the fact that bit of glue as you put it makes it almost impossible for me to breath and makes my throat close up plus some other very uncomfortable effects and it is getting worst regardless of what anyone says I can only speak on how it effects me and act on the information my body gives me when I use it and at the moment it is saying this stuff hurts stay away the same as your body tell you with resins I feel just as strong about the use of ca for me as you do about resins use for you it isn't safe for me and many other people like me it is common sense for us to stay away from the stuff

 

[Walter]

I feel just as strong about the use of ca for me as you do about resins use for you it isn't safe for me and many other people like me it is common sense for us to stay away from the stuff

That bears out the the Loctite Safety Data Sheet that Brian referred to which says:

"Prolonged exposure to high concentrations of vapours may lead to chronic effects in sensitive individuals."

Even the experts in the field cannot say whether there are long term effects:

"The available toxicological information is limited,
with no meaningful data on genotoxicity or on repeated
exposure (including carcinogenicity and reproductive
toxicity). There is also no clear understanding of the
mechanism(s) of the bronchoconstriction reactions"

So it makes sense to take reasonable precautions.

 

[Grump]

Quiet right dad, a whiff of it is enuff to want to stay away.
All these things should be used under controlled conditions, it is the users responsibility to control those conditions according to use.
With ca it is enuff to avoid the fumes, there are many other chemicals we use where that is not enuff and we should not be using them, even in open air.
Why did we ban cfc's in fridges and still mix twin pack paints carry on casting like there's no tomorrow.
We can debate this forever and get nowhere.

Edit.
Walter you quote that sheet "Prolonged exposure to high concentrations of vapours may lead to chronic effects in sensitive individuals."
suggest nobody on these forums has been subject to "Prolonged exposure." They could not bare to be for sure, as above one whiff turns your head away in an instant.

 

[Walter]

We can debate this forever and get nowhere.

That is true Brian which is why I have provided links to factual information rather than continue an uninformed discussion. As quoted above even the experts admit that there is insufficient data to draw any clear conclusions. Given that evidence, there is no basis on which you or I can argue that CA either is or is not a potential problem and the symptoms that Woody and Paulm have experienced tend to suggest that sensible precautions are wise.

I think we all agree that it makes sense to avoid the fumes if possible. Do we need to say more than that?

 

[Walter]

Walter you quote that sheet "Prolonged exposure to high concentrations of vapours may lead to chronic effects in sensitive individuals."
suggest nobody on these forums has been subject to "Prolonged exposure." They could not bare to be for sure, as above one whiff turns your head away in an instant.

That is logically inconsistent. If no-one could stand prolonged exposure then there would be no need for the warning on the SDS.

 

[nimrod]

Didn't realise I was opening such a can of worms. I would like to thank everyone for their comments, and as a lot of the comments have said I think it is up to individuals to make their own choice. I have got a mask which I am yet to use and after I have seen what effects it produces whilst wearing a mask I feel that I will be able to make a more informed decision. Regardless of how good a finish it gives I think my health is far more important and afterall there are other finishes that can be used.

Robin

 

[Walter]

Didn't realise I was opening such a can of worms.

We enjoy a bit of friendly debate Robin. Unlike the schisms and flame wars that occur on other forums none of us are going to fall out over it. You are absolutely right when you say that it is up to individuals to make their own choice. Hopefully this debate will help them to make an informed decision.

 

[Grump]

Good healthy informative debate among friends is as much fun as the joviality and piss taking that goes on here.
A lot of us have known each other for a goodly while now and know what we can say without offence.
None of us is so great we can't say sorry nor be proved wrong, septin Sir Woody of course for it is written in tablets of stone.
:pray::pray:" The right reverend Terence Victor Stone can do no wrong init.":pray::pray:

 

[Woody]

Good healthy informative debate among friends is as much fun as the joviality and piss taking that goes on here.
A lot of us have known each other for a goodly while now and know what we can say without offence.
None of us is so great we can't say sorry nor be proved wrong, septin Sir Woody of course for it is written in tablets of stone.
:pray::pray:" The right reverend Terence Victor Stone can do no wrong init.":pray::pray:

That's bloody right anall init Love yer mate even when your wrong LOL

 

[Buckeye]

So, what is the outcome to using CA is it okay or is it not

Peter

 

[nimrod]

Sorry Peter the jury is still out on that subject You will have to make your own decision.

Robin

 

[Grump]

It's OK as long as you don't sniff it init?

 

[Penpal]

Using anything has its pros and cons my recent poisoning with a so called hyperallogenic pillow top of the range but chemical residuals that knocked me out taught me like Woody says if you cant stand the heat get out of the kitchen. I use CA sparinglee with great results alongside a flow of air to shoot the fumes through the roof. So many people go to 25 coats good luck I say but not for me.Its max pollen time, grasses, trees etc over here around 30 degrees celcius noticed the newspaper gives pollen count info daily.

Most everything we eat, enjoy is carcionogenic? I remember growing through loose asbestos shed everywhere in boiler rooms as an apprentice climbing up towers clad with radar at airports very high frequency communications equipment, hanging out on the skids of helicopters photographing bush fires for research all very high risk knowing as I do now just how unwise that was warning signals now tell us play to much with CA at your own peril, my conclusion. My first time up a high wooden telegraph pole the base of down to half where it hit the ground with age and infirmity my mate with me swung the pole at an alarming rate from side to side I know what was trumps mate it was real fear something we all have to face in our own way.

Peter.

Lots of discussion so far reminds me of a mate of mine a solicitor in Rostrum for many many years closing his remarks with the words with respect as he ripped shreds of someone, being quite used to courtroom activities.

 

[Buckeye]

Sorry Peter the jury is still out on that subject You will have to make your own decision.

Robin

No, no, no, I want someone to blame if it all goes wrong

Peter