CA reactions

[Midnight_Turner]

Ok. Here is the truth about CA. CA polymerizes via a PH shift. They use an acid to keep it stable in liquid form so when hat PH shift does occur the rate of PH change has a tremendous effect on he properties of the polymerized state. The more rapid PH change the hotter and more BRITTLE the CA becomes. Hence forth why we must keep the rate down to a minimum to obtain the best finish possible.

When CA smokes it means there was contact with alkaline substances and the PH shift was extremely drastic. Many types of shop towels contains alkaline properties, also shop towels are absorbing thus loads up with liquid CA, rapidly polymerizes it and produces heat, vapors and really nasty health risks as well as a poor quality pen finish. The secret and goal is low heat, more flexible and a slower polymerization to obtain the best finish.

Thank you, very informative, so instead of paper towels, what should you use?


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[jim0505]

Hi, Midnight Turner
I struggled to get the CA method as I would like it. I tried many types of applicator and used pure cotton as my first solution. I then, out of need, unused the basic Sainsbury paper kitchen towel and it is great and cheap. I take one sheet and fold it 5 times then put a drop or two of thin or medium CA on to it and quickly wipe it back and forth on the pen to get a thin layer, spray quickly with accelerator then go again. I occasionally get the fumes, but I have always assumed it was because I put to much on and let the paper have too long a contact with the pen. I am very please with the results and I wear a helmet when I do it.

 

[EStreet]

Not all brands of CA is equal. Additives makes a large difference. There are a good 6 or so chemicals that can be used to create 'CA'.

Fumes from CA will cause allergy and flu like symptoms with exposure. it is not a question of if but a question of when. The only solution is to switch to odorless immediately. Odorless tends to be more expensive.

As for a good applicator try using the clear plastic bags the pen parts comes in, CA will not stick to that and it's a smooth surface.

 

[EStreet]

Always keep in mind to that the goal is to work smarter not harder. Use the properties of the material to your advantage. By taking advantage of the material you can get better results with certain brands than with others. Application thickness is a huge area you can clearly see this. I.e. With stick-fast brand you must use a very thin layer else you will have major problems while using bob smith brand super-gold you can put it on extremely thick and not have any problems because of it.

 

[bluntchisel]

Not all brands of CA is equal. Additives makes a large difference. There are a good 6 or so chemicals that can be used to create 'CA'.

Fumes from CA will cause allergy and flu like symptoms with exposure. it is not a question of if but a question of when. The only solution is to switch to odorless immediately. Odorless tends to be more expensive.

Ed, you've got that right - I develop running nose/eyes when I use CA. These symptoms go on for days! I no longer use it for finishing. Thank you for all the info!

Bob.

 

[EStreet]

You can use odorless with out a flu like reaction as the chemical is different. It is medical grade and does not react with mucous cells in the body like ECA does (the most common makeup of CA).

 

[bluntchisel]

Thanks, Ed, you've just told me something I did not know!

Regards,
Bob.

 

[hawkeyefxr]

Here we go again on the risks associated with CA. As yet we do not know the long term effects of using this substance. Years ago asbestos was a revelutionary product and the answer to many problems. Well we all know where that led us. I personally don't use CA for finishing I do use it for small glueing projects but not for finishing pens. I am not saying that you should not use it that is entirely your choice. The only point that I would raise is that if you want to use it as a finish for your pens you should ensure that you take adequate measures to reduce the amount of fumes that you inhale. Suitable ventilation to remove fumes and respiratory protection with a suitable mask is a must for prolonged use.

There are numerous Health and Safety data sheets available for these products here is an example of just one of them

https://www.mkmbs.co.uk/Root/Documents/B000790.COSHHData.pdf

I will end by saying that you only get one set of lungs so look after them.

When i was at work i attended a very good course on this subject with some very good points.
Asbestosis (mesothelioma) is caused when you BREATHE in particles. A vapour under a microscope is a particle so this could be a problem, always wear a mask.
Yes i am guilty of not always wearing a mask i admit. But i try to.
I was told a true tale, a guy worked in the asbestosis industry all his life but he never got asbestosis, his wife did however, she washed hid clothes and the dust got to her lungs. recounted to me by a Coroner.

 

[Woody]

With the amount of complaints about C/A as a finish why oh why do people still insist on using the rotten stuff I just hope none of you suffer any ill effects latter in life a friend of mine died from Asbestosis from working in the barking factory and so did his wife again from washing his work clothes personally some of the immediate effects seem like a warning to me that the stuff is dangerous just like smoking really it will get you in the end your body is warning you stay away listen there thats me done

 

[Vic Perrin]

With the amount of complaints about C/A as a finish why oh why do people still insist on using the rotten stuff I just hope none of you suffer any ill effects latter in life a friend of mine died from Asbestosis from working in the barking factory and so did his wife again from washing his work clothes personally some of the immediate effects seem like a warning to me that the stuff is dangerous just like smoking really it will get you in the end your body is warning you stay away listen there thats me done

I totally agree with you on this mate

 

[bluntchisel]

Well, this all very interesting but nothing lends itself so adequately to what us pen-makers want - an instant and secure adhesion. What else is available that fits this bill?

Bob.

 

[Woody]

Well, this all very interesting but nothing lends itself so adequately to what us pen-makers want - an instant and secure adhesion. What else is available that fits this bill?

Bob.

I'm only talking about using it as a finish when your standing over it and breathing the fumes in I use it as a glue outside and wank away till its dry

 

[Buckeye]

I'm only talking about using it as a finish when your standing over it and breathing the fumes in I use it as a glue outside and wank away till its dry

Just make sure you don't have any on your hands

Peter

 

[EStreet]

Did you note what I said earlier in this thread?

 

[Vic Perrin]

I'm only talking about using it as a finish when your standing over it and breathing the fumes in I use it as a glue outside and wank away till its dry

Never tried that approach Woody. Must ensure that there is no glue on your hand though

 

[Woody]

Just make sure you don't have any on your hands

Peter

Ooops thats what happens when you get intoxicated with the stuff

 

[Bill Mooney]

I'm only talking about using it as a finish when your standing over it and breathing the fumes in I use it as a glue outside and wank away till its dry

I usually have a cup of tea.

 

[Bill Mooney]

You should never wear an air helmet when using ca. The fan is pulling air into the helmet for you to breath & the filters trap the dust. They don't stop the fumes going inside the helmet & you breathing them in.

 

[Phil Dart]

I'm only talking about using it as a finish when your standing over it and breathing the fumes in I use it as a glue outside and wank away till its dry

Well, no need to tell us why you support the blind veterans I suppose. How did you get the name Woody by the way

 

[Woody]

Im never going to live that one down am I LOL