Finishes for wooden pens

[Walter]

The guy who made countless thousands of pens here in Australia glued in his pens with CA finished with CA, his upmarket sales were astounding.His one man output was outstanding with quality results. Just saying he developed a formula that worked for him used the very best of timbers,Carver and Aeroplane builder and flyer, all round good guy. Just saying.

Peter.

I don't doubt there are are lots of people who have success with using a CA finish, it is certainly the popular choice in the USA. I used it myself for a while but always felt that there must be a better way. My main reasons for no longer recommending it are firstly, the number of posts that I see on forums and groups from people experiencing problems of failure of one kind or another whether it be bloom, cracking or just difficulties with application. This suggests to me that it is simply too temperamental and sensitive to moisture, temperature and other climatic factors and inevitable vagaries of the timber substrate to recommend as a first choice. But second, and more important, is the issue of the fumes which are known to cause allergies an some individuals and the impact of which upon human health is not properly known even by the health experts. For me this conclusion to the executive summary of the Concise International Chemical Assessment Document 36 to which I provided a link in the OP says it all:

"There are limited exposure data available, espe-
cially for non-occupational settings. Also, owing to the
limited toxicological database, it is difficult to make
definitive comments about the potential risks to human
health. "

I cannot in all conscience continue to recommend to other people that they regularly use a product whose impact upon human health is unknown.

If others choose to use it themselves, play it up as the new messiah of finishes, or recommend it to others that is entirely up to them. Just saying (whatever that means).

 

[Penpal]

When I use CA the fume situation is under control using an exhaust system through the roof to atmosphere the intake is immediately above the working area on the lathe. Just as important to remove the fine dust from timber turning as well.

Using a laquer also requires care and precautions. Just saying is my way of commenting thats what it is. As you say Walter I do not recommend but like you have an opinion.

Mind you I do not ever exceed three coats of CA.

Peter.

 

[Walter]

When I use CA the fume situation is under control using an exhaust system through the roof to atmosphere the intake is immediately above the working area on the lathe. Just as important to remove the fine dust from timber turning as well.

Using a laquer also requires care and precautions.

Sensible precautions there Peter, and I agree, ventilation is also essential when using lacquer.

 

[Penpal]

Thanks Walter another thought although we get really hot times and to us before Terry,s report cold the real extremes are over in the north countries. Finishes, kit quality, timber and plastics sure get a workout. I am grateful for your posts knowing the amount of time you spend looking deeply into our hobby. When it turns into a business economics rule.

Peter.

 

[Lons]

I don't doubt there are are lots of people who have success with using a CA finish, it is certainly the popular choice in the USA. I used it myself for a while but always felt that there must be a better way. My main reasons for no longer recommending it are firstly, the number of posts that I see on forums and groups from people experiencing problems of failure of one kind or another whether it be bloom, cracking or just difficulties with application. This suggests to me that it is simply too temperamental and sensitive to moisture, temperature and other climatic factors and inevitable vagaries of the timber substrate to recommend as a first choice. But second, and more important, is the issue of the fumes which are known to cause allergies an some individuals and the impact of which upon human health is not properly known even by the health experts. For me this conclusion to the executive summary of the Concise International Chemical Assessment Document 36 to which I provided a link in the OP says it all:

"There are limited exposure data available, espe-
cially for non-occupational settings. Also, owing to the
limited toxicological database, it is difficult to make
definitive comments about the potential risks to human
health. "

I cannot in all conscience continue to recommend to other people that they regularly use a product whose impact upon human health is unknown.

If others choose to use it themselves, play it up as the new messiah of finishes, or recommend it to others that is entirely up to them. Just saying (whatever that means).

You might remember Walter that you kindly demonstrated your CA methods when I first started turning pens and I quickly learned how to get a good finish almost every time but I really don't like the experience one bit. I use extraction and heat as I don't like accelerator, I wear a mask (usually a Trend aishield) but it still makes my eyes water at times as I need to remove it to closely examine the finish which is why I'm progressing with other methods.

You're spot on with your assessments Walter, what we're doing as hobbyists wouldn't be allowed in the workplace on H&S grounds without full breathing and eye protection. The long term affects are not yet really known and I applaud your efforts in putting your views in print. Those of us who are experienced enough can choose already knowing the risks, pros and cons but it's correct that these should be pointed out to newcomers. :up:

 

[wm460]

A very good wright up Walter.

 

[hawkeyefxr]

When I use CA the fume situation is under control using an exhaust system through the roof to atmosphere the intake is immediately above the working area on the lathe. Just as important to remove the fine dust from timber turning as well.

Using a laquer also requires care and precautions. Just saying is my way of commenting thats what it is. As you say Walter I do not recommend but like you have an opinion.

Mind you I do not ever exceed three coats of CA.

Peter.

Can i ask what that collet system is, looks very neat.

Well i have made another wood pen as a test for finishes. I trotted down to Axminster and got myself some acrylic lacquer. Reading on the can it says to use sanding sealer first then the lacquer. Do you guys use just the lacquer or do you use a sealer first. My wood finish is very smooth.

 

[silver]

Check out ER collet chuck Ken.

There are several that you can use to fit your pen mandrel shaft in too or can use for turning Ll sorts of projects.

Take a look here for the collet types, sizes ect.

ER Collets - ER8, ER11, ER16, ER20, ER25, ER32, ER40, ER50 Collets - MariTool

They can have a fitting for MT or specific fitting for threaded lathes.

 

[Walter]

Reading on the can it says to use sanding sealer first then the lacquer. Do you guys use just the lacquer or do you use a sealer first. My wood finish is very smooth.

I use sanding sealer between each grit of abrasive but not after the final sanding. I find that reduces the number of coats of lacquer required.

 

[hawkeyefxr]

Many thanks Walter, it is ebony as i said earlier in the thread. I am doing two pencils, one has some light coloured sections, i thought this would look good under a gloss finish. I well leave the other one natural.

 

[Penpal]

Can i ask what that collet system is, looks very neat.

Well i have made another wood pen as a test for finishes. I trotted down to Axminster and got myself some acrylic lacquer. Reading on the can it says to use sanding sealer first then the lacquer. Do you guys use just the lacquer or do you use a sealer first. My wood finish is very smooth.

Ken the collet system is made by Vicmarc,is excellent quality.

Peter.

 

[Scots Bill]

Hi Walter, thanks for the tip on your preferred method of finishing. Got Halfords spray acrylic, got the cardboard box, now what? do I hang the blank on string and set it spinning to get an even coat? My efforts at spraying anything in the past have been a disaster.

 

[hawkeyefxr]

i'm going to make a couple of small wood cones with holes in the middle to centralise the spin and stop any lacquer getting in the tube, more important the threads for me.
Just a gentle spin though.

 

[hawkeyefxr]

Ken the collet system is made by Vicmarc,is excellent quality.

Peter.

Found them in Aus, It comes in a PVC box complete with eight (8) collets (sizes: 7-6, 8-7, 10-9, 11-10, 15-14, 16-15, 19-18 and 20-19), two (2) C-Spanners and one (1) Collet Holder. $125 Ays dollars (that about £74.00) with $12 shipping.
A thought for a later date.

 

[billyb_imp]

Found them in Aus, It comes in a PVC box complete with eight (8) collets (sizes: 7-6, 8-7, 10-9, 11-10, 15-14, 16-15, 19-18 and 20-19), two (2) C-Spanners and one (1) Collet Holder. $125 Ays dollars (that about £74.00) with $12 shipping.
A thought for a later date.

Have a look at Axminster Junior Chuck - Chucks - Woodturning Chucks - Lathe Accessories - Machinery Accessories - Accessories | Axminster Tools & Machinery Ken, I have been using this collet chuck from Axminster over the last year or so.

Comes with 3 collets with more available, choose chuck to suit your lathe / head thread, you may need an adaptor.

 

[Scots Bill]

Thanks Ken, cones eh, not ice cream ones I hope.

 

[hawkeyefxr]

Have a look at Axminster Junior Chuck - Chucks - Woodturning Chucks - Lathe Accessories - Machinery Accessories - Accessories | Axminster Tools & Machinery Ken, I have been using this collet chuck from Axminster over the last year or so.

Comes with 3 collets with more available, choose chuck to suit your lathe / head thread, you may need an adaptor.

That is perfect, will be looking at this in the new Year.

 

[hawkeyefxr]

Thanks Ken, cones eh, not ice cream ones I hope.

Nah, would melt in the summer lol. Actually i have just bought some 12mm wood ball with hole in them from ebay. I really need to keep the lacquer away from the thread in the brass tube.

 

[Walter]

Hi Walter, thanks for the tip on your preferred method of finishing. Got Halfords spray acrylic, got the cardboard box, now what? do I hang the blank on string and set it spinning to get an even coat? My efforts at spraying anything in the past have been a disaster.

I hammer a couple of nails into a piece of scrap wood and slip a cone bush onto each (you know the ones I mean, they come free with the mandrel and you never use them). The bushes stop the blanks from sticking to the wooden base. Then slip the blanks over the nails and spray away. Several thin coats from whatever distance is recommended on the spray can you are using.

View attachment 32256

 

[Vic Perrin]

There you go Walters solution ain't going to cost you a lot