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I always new it was the right thing to do!

Lons

Lons

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Hi Maurice

I haven't contributed to this thread until now as I have little experience of drilling acrylic pen blanks. What I do have however is the experience of almost 10 years in the plastics distribution industry with one of our main product ranges being ICI Prespex in sheet, rod, block and tube as well as polycarb and most other semi-finished and engineering plastics.

Whilst this was a long time ago, the recommendations at the time and my practical experience was that acrylics must always be drilled at slow speed. I saw many examples of acrilic melting around high speed tooling. I've done it myself with a jigsaw:whistling:

I don't drill on the lathe as I am lucky to have a decent Meddings pillar drill but I used to and always held the chuck without problems. I guess like anything else it's just a case of knowing the risks and being careful. We all should be mature enough I think to read and learn from others experiences, that's what a forum is for surely, but then to make our own mind up on how we use that information.

I for one thank you for posting as it serves to remind us that our pastime can be dangerous and I also use and recommend a polycarbonate mask. I renewed mine just a few weeks ago.
I seriously doubt that anyone on this forum (unlike others) would be deliberately abusive, it's just guys with strong opinions, expressing them. It's has always been thus!

It would be sad for everyone if you left over a difference of opinion.
Cheers
Bob
 
M

mattyts

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West Yorkshire
I have also had a similar experience,I used a cheap drill bit to drill wood and can only guess that the heat from the drilling caused the drill to expand,lodging itself into the wood then as I withdrew the chuck,it came out of the tailstock (lathe was running at 500 RPM) and was still attached to the wood,spinning at 500 RPM for only a split second,it then because un attached and flung itself out and luckily,back towards the stone wall behind my late (not forward,where I was standing) the drill snapped and the drill chuck was heavily damaged.

I was wearing a visor with safety goggles underneath

I also saw someone mention switches earlier,is there any wood lathes with the safety precautions of a metal lathe? the metal lathe I use has a foot bar that has too be compressed for the lathe to operate,if incase of an incident,you step back from the lathe,it will instantly power down.

PS. To all those who moan about misting of goggles and visors,get yourself some of this,there is no excuse where safety is concerned
Eyewear
It's used in the engineering trade for safety equipment prone to misting,and its great. one quick spray, a wipe off, and the safety specs are mist free for at least 2 full shifts (2 x 12 hours of use). the spray is a cleaner, lens protector as well as having anti misting properties.
 
Penpal

Penpal

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Peter
mattyts said:
I have also had a similar experience,I used a cheap drill bit to drill wood and can only guess that the heat from the drilling caused the drill to expand,lodging itself into the wood then as I withdrew the chuck,it came out of the tailstock (lathe was running at 500 RPM) and was still attached to the wood,spinning at 500 RPM for only a split second,it then because un attached and flung itself out and luckily,back towards the stone wall behind my late (not forward,where I was standing) the drill snapped and the drill chuck was heavily damaged.

I was wearing a visor with safety goggles underneath

I also saw someone mention switches earlier,is there any wood lathes with the safety precautions of a metal lathe? the metal lathe I use has a foot bar that has too be compressed for the lathe to operate,if incase of an incident,you step back from the lathe,it will instantly power down.

PS. To all those who moan about misting of goggles and visors,get yourself some of this,there is no excuse where safety is concerned
Eyewear
It's used in the engineering trade for safety equipment prone to misting,and its great. one quick spray, a wipe off, and the safety specs are mist free for at least 2 full shifts (2 x 12 hours of use). the spray is a cleaner, lens protector as well as having anti misting properties.
Click to expand...

From the gems mate I do find always this problem especially in our cold times and look forward to more safety and success. Really excited at the prospect. Do I call you Matt?

Kind regards Peter.
 
Penpal

Penpal

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Normally Peter thanks Matt we have one son Matt five daughters our Matt is the second youngest at 52 yrs.

I have on my computer a map of West Yorkshire where in this area are you?

Peter:thumbs:
 
Woody

Woody

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mattyts said:
I also saw someone mention switches earlier,is there any wood lathes with the safety precautions of a metal lathe? the metal lathe I use has a foot bar that has too be compressed for the lathe to operate,if incase of an incident,you step back from the lathe,it will instantly power down.
.
Click to expand...

There you go Matt one foot switch from but you can probably find cheaper elsewere axminster Foot Switches with Trailing Plug & Socket - Switchgear - Machinery Accessories - Wood Working | Axminster.co.uk
 
Walter

Walter

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Juat to follow up on my apology to Neil for the use of the expression "self important". It was indeed a totally inappropriate term to use as not only did it not properly express what I meant to say it was somewhat derogatory. I should not take shortcuts with language when trying to make quick replies. Sorry if it offended.

I still stand by the message I intended to convey however and I believe we should all be careful not to be so convinced of the efficacy and safety of our own methods that we close our minds to the opinions of others, especially not to the extent that we see them as abuse. We all learn from others and I believe for example that it was Neil who drew my attention to the inadvisability of wearing a respirator when working with CA as the filters are designed for wood dust not chemical fumes and will simply draw the fumes into the mask rather than protecting you. I have changed my own practice and the advice I give as a result.

There are a couple of issues about which I still think I need to make my opinion clear, since many people do follow my advice and I feel I have a responsibility to be unequivocal on matters of health and safety.

First of all it was indeed good of Maurice to share his experience with us and remind us all of the need to wear suitable PPE and this holds true for whatever we are doing in the workshop. The fact that he was standing out of the "line of fire" is also a good reminder to be careful about positioning yourself and applies equally to avoiding kickback from saws and planers.

Wearing PPE however is secondary safety. Attention also needs to be given to the primary safety issue here, the fact that the chuck and part of a drill bit were able to become airborne in the first place and how this can be prevented in the future. The only way to do this is to carry out a proper assessment of why the incident happened, and that is something we cannot do here on the forum but which Maurice, if he wants to prevent a recurrence of the problem will need to do himself taking into account exactly what he was doing at the time, spindle speed, drilling pressure and anything else that might have influenced the matter including the capabilities of the tool and the drilling properties of the material and the opinions of others outside of those vending and manufacturing the drill bit. To continue as before without changing either the tools or the method risks a recurrence. If such an assessment is undertaken I for one would be interested to see and possibly learn from the outcome even if it disproves any of my previously held opinions.

Second we come to the issue of holding onto chucks as the drill bit is withdrawn. I repeat yet again and will continue to do so as long as necessary that holding on to any part of the lathe or work or ancillary equipment that is revolving or could revolve if a catch were to occur is, to avoid using any emotive terms that might offend, a potentially dangerous practice.

The chuck in a pillar drill is held in place by a Morse taper and has to contend with gravity as well as the drilling forces and requires no assistance to retain it in the quill. In thousands of drilling operations on a pillar drill I can count on the fingers of one hand the number of times the chuck has become detached from the quill and on every occasion it was because I was using the wrong bit or the wrong speed for the material. Furthermore, when the chuck becomes detached from a pillar drill it stops revolving. This is not the case with a lathe as when the taper releases the chuck continues to revolve placing enormous stresses on the drill bit with inevitable consequences.

You are correct Neil, it is not possible to fit a draw bar to a telescopic quill, but not only have I never owned a lathe with such a quill, but a draw bar should be entirely unnecessary for the scale of work we are undertaking. If a pillar drill can deal with the drilling forces and gravity and be withdrawn without manual assistance then so can a tailstock chuck.

If the tailstock chuck does begin to revolve then the answer is not to take hold of it, but to stop the lathe, resolve the problem that is causing the bit to jam in the workpiece and re-seat the Morse taper in the tailstock quill before continuing.

That is my advice, informed by thirty years of turning, researching turning related issues and writing about turning. It is up to anyone reading it to follow it or not as they choose. If you are going to advise others however, please take care that the advice you are giving is not potentially dangerous.

Edit: The final sentence above is not directed at anyone in particular or intended to offend it is just advice.
 
Woody

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If you want to solve the problem of the chuck coming loose it it quite simple by changing the arbor for one with a thread normally 3/8th whitworth and a piece of threaded bar a washer that will not restrict the movement of your tailstock and a nut if it works on a metalwork lathe which it dose well it did for me for years the same on milling machines then there is no reason why it wont on a wood lathe job done Stub Arbor - Tooling for Milling Machines - Milling - Metal Working | Axminster.co.uk this one has a stud for the chuck which can be drilled and tapped so a machine screw can be fitted through the chuck like they do on hand drills there fool proof now will anyone bother if you do this problem will never arise again
 
Walter

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True enough Woody, but as Neil points out, not possible unless you have a hollow tailstock, the Record Power CL type seem not to have but never having owned one or looked closely at the tailstock I can't be sure:

8242b.jpg
 
Woody

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Well I have had 5 record lathes including the DML24, CL3 and 4 the RPML and the maxy 1 they all had a hollow taistock and lets be honest there are very few wood lathes that dont otherwise we wouldn't be able to do long hole boring maybe some of the very small cheep and nasty lathes which you cant drill on anyway
 
Woody

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Neil said:
Yup, a drawbar or similar concept, but you can't do that into a telescopic quill, unless I've very much mistaken the issue, we're talking about tail stock drilling.
Click to expand...

Sorry Neil it can be done I have already explained how it is quite simple mate
 
Penpal

Penpal

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mattyts said:
Near Wakefield.
Click to expand...

Thanks Matt looking at the map Wakefield is smack centre east to West up a bit higher Nth to Sth, noted the 7 degree temp as well. Knottingly looks about twenty minutes away to Jims place probably wont seem too long before our temps drop to 5 or so and we will wish for autumn weather again. At this temp shorts kept on seems like good advice and move around quite briskly.

Kind regards Peter.:thumbs:
 
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